Christianity Gets Banned

Well, here is something on which Lobotero and I partly agree. Religious freedom is a good thing.

What about religious freedom in Ukraine? Unfortunately, most of the world has totalitarian and authoritarian regimes. Sadly, freedom is not something most people know how to make work. We may want to be free, but not every population of people has the moral character to make freedom work. The basic problem is this. Where do “my” rights end and “your” rights begin? Pride tempts us to respect the rights of others as little as we can. Instead of trying to protect the rights of our family, friends, neighbors, and countrymen; we allow strong men to organize us into factions, and each of these factions seeks dominance. Rival factions pull nations apart in civil war.

Due to increasing conflicts between rival factions, our republic in the USA is tottering. Because some strong men consider it an obstacle to their desires for power, most of our population no longer respects our Constitution, and we don’t bother to study it carefully. Therefore, we don’t appreciate our First Amendment rights, including the concept of religious freedom. Otherwise, we would not have substantial numbers of people trying to ban the “hate speech” of clerics.

Can we save our constitutional republic? God knows. We certainly cannot make Ukraine the USA. Unless the people of Ukraine are defending their own country and their own beliefs, they won’t fight well. If people of Ukraine don’t fight well, then Russia will surely subjugate Ukraine, and that won’t be an improvement.

So, the real issue for the USA is what we define as our national interest in the conflict between Russia and Ukraine. The Biden Administration has not done that.

We are spending tens of billions arming the military forces of Ukraine.
1. That has angered Russia, and Russia has threatened to use nukes.
2. We have done a poor job of tracking where our money has been spent.
3. We have not defined an exit strategy. Our policy goals are unclear. We spending huge sums and risking nuclear war for what?

In other words, President Joe Biden has made another foreign policy mess. When the people of Ukraine fought surprisingly well, they shamed the USA (President Joe Biden) into supporting them. Ever since then the wishes of President Volodymyr Zelensky have dominated our policy towards Ukraine.

Do the folks who lead our government know what they are doing? They probably do to at least some extent. That is one reason their bumbling should worry us. What if there bumbling is not entirely unintentional?

The victory of Ukrainian military forces is probably the best outcome. Nevertheless, we need to know how our money is being spent. We need to reduce the high potential for fraud, waste, and abuse.

The people leading our government have a terrible record of fraud, waste and abuse. They also have a proclivity for enslaving us, and their dishonesty poses a greater threat to our country than any foreign power.

Check out => https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/11/house-gop-brings-bill-to-audit-ukraine-spending-nearing-103-billion/, https://dailycaller.com/2022/11/17/exclusive-house-republicans-introduce-legislation-auditing-ukraine-spending/ and https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-admin-scrambles-track-20b-ukraine-aid-house-republicans-warn-audits.

In Saner Thought

NO this is not some regurgitation from some half mad preacher predicting the end of religion if Dems and the “Left” have their way…..not all…it is about a real action taken by a democratic leader…..

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky announced he is seeking to ban all religions with ties to Russia. He claims the move is needed to “guarantee spiritual independence to Ukraine.”

This law will target millions of Ukrainians who identify as Russian Orthodox.

During his nightly address on Thursday, Zelensky announced he was introducing legislation that would eliminate religious organizations affiliated with Russia from operating in Ukraine. He said this will make “it impossible for religious organizations affiliated with centers of influence in the Russian Federation to operate in Ukraine.”

The Ukrainian leader said it was necessary to purge the church to preserve the country’s spiritual independence. Adding, “We will never allow anyone to build an empire inside…

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22 thoughts on “Christianity Gets Banned

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    1. At first I thought you might be anti-Semitic. So, I went to your about page. It seems you are anti-Everyone.

      Anyway, it strikes me that you are one of those people who uses words, but you don’t know what the words mean. You say you teach the truth, not doctrine, but all you are doing is teaching a particular doctrine and calling it truth.

      Is the truth a particular doctrine? Yes. Does a particular doctrine have to be true? No. Is the particular doctrine you teach true? Given that you are so confused about the meaning of words? Not a likely possibility.

        1. What is the point of debating someone who doesn’t respect the rules of logic or the meaning of words? You call someone a bigot. Then you attach a video that has nothing to do with them.

          Debating you would be like accepting an invitation to swim in a sewage lagoon. Just because the water is warm doesn’t mean you should be swimming in that filth.

          1. I don’t debate, I just tell people The Truth. And who have I called a bigot? I steer well clear of Cultural Jew Marxist slogans at all times. However, it’s interesting how you utilised it straight away.

            Now back to my questions which, you have not answered, having deflected away from the first and completely ignored the second.

            Now I have another: What criteria, or imagined foundation, are you employing in order to come to the conclusion that any discussion with me would be like swimming in filth?

  1. No Tom, I never said you if you do not share my opinions you are a bad person.

    You will have to admit the war in Ukraine is not just about Russia and Ukraine, notwithstanding the fact a crazy Russian has his mindset and fingers hovering over nuclear weapon launch codes.

    I can understand you being an upright and diligent American citizen wanting to curb wasted and non-beneficial funding. I think it is well spent because if the Russians are able to invade Ukraine what message does that send to China and North Korea and the rest of the world?

    I am surprised you do not see Marge Greene’s contradiction. Does she not believe God would care about saving Ukrainian lives, but care only about the unborn foetus?

    I do not think you will find many martyrs and anyone who believes God will save them from Putin’s devils are far and few these days.

    You put words in my mouth, I never said all conservatives are evil, however there are a lot of them that likely are evil such as the link you provided to The Federalist that is an extreme right wing publication and a Trump election denier, therefore I would not believe one word unless it came across as actual real news from other news sources, and nor should you.

    “We also don’t know the situation in remote parts of the world all that well. We don’t know enough about what is happening stick our nose in every conflict.”

    To many decades late for that thought, and I am sure your government will understand the consequences if NATO were to do nothing, even if your President does often not appear to be all there, I think he is doing the right thing with this issue. It will be a curse being 80 years old, I am a decade younger but I can somewhat relate to Biden’s slow and sleepy demeanour.

    1. sklyjd

      You are worried about someone putting words in your mouth, but the only reason you brought up the abortion issue is to put words in Rep. Greene’s mouth.

      When we give politicians our money to spend, it doesn’t make any sense to allow them to spend it without verifying how it is being spent. But that too complicated for you. So. you call other people extremists. Try a mirror.

      Serious debate involves a discussion of the facts. That is not what you do. Instead of discussing the merits of arguments, you attack the character of the messenger.

      1. Rep. Greene’s mouth has claimed that they will not fund another penny for Ukraine once the new Congress takes over in January. Was she lying, not supporting her partys criteria and just raving? If not I think that is an extremist view and says nothing about an audit or Ukrainian lives. Comparing this woman Greene’s comment with her pro-life support where she screamed at another woman “Try being a Christian and supporting life!” makes this a complete turn around regarding supporting life, this is not me attacking her character, this is a fact, she is supposed to be a politician and she said it.

        By the way Tom, my mirror tells me I’m good looking 🙂

        1. Rep. Green is one representative among 435. She is not even the representative from my district. If if I had wanted to do so, I could not vote for her. So, you can use Greene as your stalking horse, but I am not going defend everything she says.

          Why won’t I defend everything Greene says? Why won’t I defend everything anyone says? Except for Jesus, what would it accomplish?

          Instead of debating the issues, you are trying to debate whether or not Greene is perfect. Is Greene perfect? No. Does that make you right? Of course not! Does your mirror tell you that you are perfect?

  2. Tom,

    I seem to remember that a high position Orthodox priest supports Putin’s decision to invade Ukraine.

    .In my opinion, Zelensky needs to be loaned a Democrat public relation expert to explain his decision and emulate USA politicians who have been in essence do the same thing by making it unaffordable for poor and average families in the USA to afford for their children
    to be taught religious values of wisdom and love in the Bible, and still gert elected by people who trust that Democrats are saviors for the poor and middle class..

    As the idiom goes “all’s fair in love and war.”

    Why any country will give money to another country without an audit is pure folly, in my opinion. Add Raegan’s Republican belief, “Trust but verify”

    Regards and goodwill blogging.

  3. In case you did not realise the churches were heavily involved in spying and underground activities throughout the world wars. I am sure if you were a Ukrainian and your family was murdered by Russians you would have a different opinion, Good on Biden and the free world for sending all the help they can. Surely a Christian can understand what is going on and worship in private until this war is over.

    1. I suppose opposing the Holocaust and Communist purges justifies the persecution of Christians by Atheistic Nazis and Communists?

      Churches are organizations. Organizations often form along ethnic lines. So, we can presume the Russian Orthodox church has a lot of Russians in it?

      Individuals and organization can be used to deprive people of their God-given rights. When an individual or an organization works to deprive other people of their God-given rights, that individual or organization needs to be prosecuted. The issue is what that individual does, not religious belief or the lack of religious belief.

      What we don’t know is whether the Russian Orthodox church is being used for military purposes against Ukraine. However, Zelensky speech indicates he believes the Russian Orthodox Church is being so used. If the Russian Orthodox is a militarily partisan organization, then Zelensky would be justified in outlawing it. Why don’t you review whether Zelensky made a viable case for that?

  4. Pleased to read that post Tom, and to know that somebody understands the value of human rights and the need for religious freedom.

    What Zelensky is doing is really chilling, especially since some 88% of Ukrainians are Orthodox, a good chunk of them being Russian orthodox. Several years ago I read a quote that said, “to be Ukrainian is to be Orthodox,” so we have a situation where religious tradition is a part of identity, culture, nationalism, history, for several hundred years. To come along and attempt to impose your own desires on massive numbers of people is tyranny, not democracy.

    Both Canada and the US dabbled in this kind of religious oppression during covid and it is downright scary. Government is force, period. Some people don’t seem to realize that the way you “ban religion” is by arresting pastors, putting padlocks on churches, and threatening, terrorizing, and intimidating individuals.

    1. In this era, government can also do what the Chinese Communists are doing. They can take away your right to buy and sell. That is driving the push to a digital currency. If every transaction is recorded, then no can pay you, and you cannot buy anything without the government knowing. Any if they cut you off, then you are reduced to bartering with people.

    2. Have you ever thought that freedom for human rights starts at actually not having your country attacked and your people murdered. Religious freedom means squat to these people when they have nowhere to live and no food to eat. Nobody can tell you what to believe so these Christians are fine, they are not going to the gas chambers or been shot en mass, they are eliminating the organisations that run religious activities that will have been infiltrated by Russian spies and sympathisers.

      1. sklyjd

        Did you actually read what I wrote? It seems to me you are attacking a straw man.

        With respect to Ukraine, what I called for was an audit on how our money is being spent. Obviously, I would also like to know our exit strategy. What you find wrong with that I have no idea.

        Does religious freedom mean anything to the people of Ukraine? I suspect many would disagree with this comment.

        Religious freedom means squat to these people when they have nowhere to live and no food to eat.

        I don’t think the people of Ukraine worship government. Otherwise, what is the point of resisting Russia?

        When Russia invaded, Ukrainians had little reason to believe that they could defeat Russian military forces. They fought anyway. They fought for their independence from a foreign power and the tyranny that foreign power would impose. Their fight for independence includes fighting for the freedom to believe what Ukrainians want to believe.

        Do Ukrainians believe in individual religious liberty? I don’t know.

        Note that Zelensky’s proposal is not a call for Atheism or Secularism. His law is designed to ensure spiritual independence for Ukraine. I suspect he would just as happily go after Secularist political parties with Russian ties.

        1. The audit of money is something of a precursor to pulling military assistance from Ukraine. I bet it will not be long before the extreme right start screaming at Biden about pulling the assistance due to the costs. Marge Greene has claimed that they will not fund another penny for Ukraine once the new Congress takes over in January. Do you support this?

          The huge fuss over abortion issues, all this rubbish about saving lives is appearing to have no weight when it comes to saving Ukrainian lives, many whom are Christian but obviously does not suit some Republican’s idealogical criteria.

          The exit strategy I would suggest will be when the Russians have hung up their guns and gone home or hung up Putin, whatever comes first.

          Having food to eat and shelter from freezing temperatures I think would be a priority over religious zealotry wouldn’t you think?

          The Ukrainians have no hesitation about supporting their government, the Ukrainians have memories of their treatment during the USSR years and the more recent annexation of Crimea to motivate them.

          “When Russia invaded, Ukrainians had little reason to believe that they could defeat Russian military forces.”

          That is totally wrong, since the annexing of Crimea the British have been training their army in anticipation of invasion and now are training their civilians in basic military skills and as we can see it all appears to be paying off.

          Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Lithuania, Canada, the Netherlands, Australia and New Zealand have already or will soon send trainers to the U.K. to accelerate training.The US is also planning to boost their training contingent.

          I should imagine Zelensky will go against anything that will assist the Russian invasion. This war is less about political and religious issues that you always pull out of a hat but about survival of this country and it’s people, a moral responsibility for the world I would say.

          1. sklyjd

            So, if I don’t share all your opinions, I am bad person. Of course, to have an opinion about what is good and what is bad, we have to have some sort of religious belief.

            A audit is a precursor to withdrawing funding from Ukraine? Would that not have to have something to do with how the money is being spent? Asking for an audit is equivalent to asking for a spending cut?

            What does abortion have to do with military funding for Ukraine?

            I didn’t think you had the authority to announce our exit strategy for Ukraine. Would you please let President Joe Biden’s staff know? I don’t think our president is on top of things these days.

            Eating and staying warm has a priority over religious zealotry? I think you will eventually find many martyrs who disagree.

            Do the people of Ukraine have reason to be concerned over the possibility of dictatorship? Yes, of course, they do. Yet you deride my concern when I point to my government, and you think your government composed of secular saints. It seeems that only Conservatives are evil, which in your mind makes Putin a Conservative, I suppose.

            So, you knew in advance that Ukraine could be Russia?

            Here is something interesting.
            https://news.yahoo.com/ukraines-authorities-explain-why-ukrainian-122510297.html

            The Zelensky administration is going after the Orthodox Church, not just the Russian Orthodox Church. Listen to yourself, and maybe you will understand why.

            Zelensky is not some saint.
            https://thefederalist.com/2022/12/05/theres-no-such-thing-as-press-freedom-in-zelenskys-dissent-crushing-ukraine/

            The USA is like any other country. When we are dealing with a situation like that in Ukraine, we have to figure our best interest. With a small percentage of the world’s population and wealth, we cannot afford to waste lives and national treasure chasing rabbits down holes. We also don’t know the situation in remote parts of the world all that well. We don’t know enough about what is happening stick our nose in every conflict. Unfortunately, the Biden administration has decided to spend lots of money as if that in and of itself would solve the problem, and they used up lots of the munitions US soldiers would need if we had to send our military forces into harm’s way. That is unwise, and there is nothing wrong with saying so.

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