Prince William-Manassas Family Alliance
Respiratory droplets, produced when a man is sneezing (from here).
The current quarantine called ‘social distancing’ has been imposed on us in order to minimize the transfer of the coronavirus from one person to others. We are trying to prevent many from becoming ill and even dying from the disease. The sooner the wave of infection begins to recede, the sooner businesses can reopen and a semblance of normal daily living can resume.
COVID-19 seems to have come almost out of the blue to ravage the entire world. No one can declare immunity from its spread. A sense of panic has seized us, leading folks to hoard commodities like toilet paper, hand sanitizer, food, and cleaning supplies. It has forced us to stop assembling at school, church, shopping centers and many work sites. Incomes have been sharply cut or reduced, those fortunate enough to be able to telework sit…
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So God exclusively hates just the two supposed sins that you are either incapable of or have absolutely no inclination to commit? Of the many possible terrible sins in the world (war, rape, greed, hypocrisy, idolatry, kleptocracy, human caused climate change). these two you just happen to believe are the proximate cause of God bringing this Pandemic down upon the innocent and the guilty alike. Don’t you find that kind of morally convenient? And thought it had something to do with wet markets and eating bats.
Where does Doris say God only hates two sins? I think Doris has just identified what she thinks are the predominate sins of our nation.
Here is an observation I made to marmoewp.
Does God punish sin? Well, I hope he is punishing me for mine.
That quote is from the Old Testament, Proverbs 3:11-12.
I suppose it was natural to anthropomorphize God so that we could understand the infinitely fathomless as we understand ourselves. As you say, God does not change, but our understanding of God has changed and grown drastically over time and throughout the Bible. If Jesus really is God in the mystery of the Holy Trinity that we believe represents the One God, then God’s suffering in Christ Jesus through us, with us and in us truly is a game changer in our understanding of suffering.
What is the difference in what you call “discipline” between the seemingly random acts of nature and the acts of a cruel and angry parent who arbitrarily beats all His children, the good and the bad alike, out of vengeance and a momentary petulance? For some insight, look to Jesus’ parable of the Prodigal Son.
All the Prodigal Son’s real suffering was not inflicted on him as cruel punishment by the Father – he brought It all upon himself through his own choices. All the time the Prodigal Son wandered, his Father suffered in him and with him even though the father did not make the choices. That’s what all living parents do. That’s why the Father welcomed the Prodigal Son home with love when the Son chose to come home – it ended the meaningless suffering for both of them. (Notice also the Loyal Son’s bewilderment in the Father lack of anger and retribution).
I think it is also important not to confuse God with God’s construct of a finite and fallen creation where random suffering exists. Suffering itself is ubiquitous and often apparently arbitrary within the construct. The loyal son will suffer and die of some disease regardless of his loyalty. The Father’s wealth could wither and disappear in a drought or a plague of locusts that brings down to righteous and the sinful alike. Don’t look for meaning in the construct that God provides where God allows our choices. LOOK FOR MEANING IN OUR CHOICES THAT THIS FINITE AND FALLEN CONSTRUCT PROVIDES FOR US TO MAKE.
That meaning (or lack thereof) is defined by the practice of God’s love in sacrificial suffering in Christ in Him, through Him and WITH Him. Thinking that this natural plague, the Pandemic, is God’s arbitrary punishment on all because God allowed a few people to make only certain choices that we deem sinful is the jealous pettiness of the self righteous son – it’s not the heart or intent of loving Father.
Christians don’t anthropomorphize God. We were made in the image of God. Therefore, to the extent it helps us to understand Him, God explains Himself in human terms. We, however, are not spirits. We are not infinite. We are not omniscient. We are not even good. We are not perfect images of God.
I am kind of puzzled. It is not clear what you are complaining about. Not enough love in this post? God calls us His children. Do you really think not disciplining us be proof of His love?
You say only a few are guilty. Really? Only a few people of guilty of aborting the unborn and sexual perversion. Only a few people are prideful and selfish?
Anyway, check out this comment => https://familyallianceonline.org/2020/04/03/why-covid-19/#comment-1176.
You’re deflecting brother because you know the main points that I make are true. You’re avoiding the real issue which is whether a loving God punishes his children with suffering as if he were a small hurt human father demanding reciprocity and raining down vengeance indiscriminately.
You talk of God giving us anthropological examples in scripture so that God can explain Himself in ways that we can comprehend. Well! Exactly! Jesus’ metaphor of the Prodigal Son is just such a way of God explaining in human terms that we can try to understand. The question is, when we are ready to understand, do we interpret the metaphor on God’s terms or our own.
I think that it is obvious that in the Prodigal Son Parable the Father represents God as the Father. And the two sons represent us as God’s children. Both sons are sinners – the Prodigal Son because he separates himself from the Father to selfishly waste his inheritance on vice. And the Loyal Son is also a sinner because his service is less out of love for his father and his brother than out of the selfish expectation of some future reward. Both sinful sons choose their own suffering, and the Father suffers with them and for them. The Father allows them their wrong choices. The Father punishes neither son for those bad choices. (In effect, their choices are self punishing).
The Father’s love, however, is obviously unconditional and unselfish. It’s always the sons’ selfishness that gets in the way of the love their father seeks to teach them.
Tell me Tom, when we view other people’s sins jealously as deserving God’s retribution, which selfish son are we being? How do we emulate the Father’s love for both his sons?
I know that you are going to claim that God’s love is not unconditional and reference something Old Testament. If it is not, and we are all sinners, then how do we explain Jesus? The only condition seems to be less what we choose to hate than how we choose to love. God always takes us back.
Here is the post I promised earlier.
No plague in earth’s history has created such an upheaval.
The plague in the 14th Century is estimated to have wiped out 30% of 60% of the European population.
I did a double-take on that line too. Still, there is an element of truth. During the 14th Century, a plague might have had continental implications, but no one would have looked upon a plague as a world wide problem.
The 1st Century Roman Empire was just about as well organized and technically advance as 14th Century Europe. The Romans looked upon the world as their Empire. That did not much begin to change until the Industrial Revolution.
“but no one would have looked upon a plague as a world wide problem.”
The world back then consisted of Europe, the Middle East, China and the rest of Asia
All of them were devastated:
Curious! You find what you think an error. Then, even though it has nothing to do with the main point of the article, that is all you want to discuss? Have you conceded the main point?
Modern communications and transportation has made the world smaller.
Think about how this paragraph ends.
Political correctness requires us to think globally now, but we don’t. When I think of COVID-19, I think of the places I see, of my family, friends and neighbors. Is that because I don’t watch TV? Well, in the 14th Century there was no TV.
The people of Europe regarded the Black Death as a sign of God’s wrath. Were they wrong? Is COVID-19 a sign of God’s wrath? I don’t know the mind of God. I just know that our sins make it much more difficult to anticipate and deal with problems like COVID-19, that for all practical purposes we are punished for our sins.
For someone claiming to not know God’s ways, you are very certain, that Covid-19 is God’s punishment for our sins, the ones that just happen to align with a central focus of your blog: LGBTs and abortion. Going by your judgement, Trump is to be held blameless of the extent of spread of the pandemic, but those people are at fault that it happened, at all.
Is this the Christian way, brother? Accusing those as scapegoats, whose behaviour you loathe.
LGBTs and abortion are a central focus of my blog? Not really. I think it more important to stand for something than against something.
So, why would I think COVID-19 is a punishment from God? Well, the pandemic certainly is punishing. Romans 8:28 makes the point that God leaves nothing, absolutely nothing to chance. And Hebrews 12:4-11 makes it clear that God does punish us.
So, is God punishing us for abortion and sexual perversion or some other sins? Given what the Bible says about baby killing and sexual perversion? Do we actually need to debate that? You think we are guilty of worst sins?
Is Trump blameless? I don’t know how God judges specific individuals. I just don’t think he is specifically responsible for the USA being unprepared.